Even your emotions have an echo, in so much space
By Thoreau
Friend of the blog Jennifer has ventured into the world of 9/11 Truthers and written a nice report on her travels. She observes (correctly) that it’s almost impossible for the educated layman to know what to believe. Hell, even I don’t know enough about the physics of melting steel to give an authoritative answer on most aspects of it (although I probably do know enough of the relevant physics to have a better bullshit detector). That’s what makes conspiracy theories so damn frustrating. Inevitably you can’t answer all of their questions, so you’re left wondering. Fortunately, they generally do sane people the favor of being blatantly wrong on a few things.
I do have to quibble with her on one thing:
Damon Bean, Richard Gage and Steven Jones never would answer our questions regarding just who they thought was responsible for the attacks; they would only say that, while they don’t know who did commit the attacks, they know al-Qaeda didn’t.
If not al-Qaeda, then who?
We went online again in search of someone to blame. Anyone to blame, with the following caveat: we ignored all Web sites containing phrases like “Jew-controlled media,” “Illuminati” or “Zionist hegemony.”
Maybe that’s why we couldn’t find any alternate scapegoat.
I’m skeptical that every single Truther site mentioned Jews and the Illuminati. Surely there must be a few Truther sites that confine their theorizing to Dick Cheney and Halliburton. Have we really sunk so low that we have to look to a small Middle Eastern country for all of our conspiracies? Are there no more American conspiracies? I’d like to think that we could achieve conspiracy independence.
Where have you gone, Majestic 12? A nation turns it lonely eyes to you. (Woo-ooh-ooh)
Comment by TGGP —
January 30, 2008 @ 2:57 am
Only neophytes to the Byzantine world of puppet-strings by which we are pulled things the ultimate cause are Zionists. They are of course the tools of the Freemasons, who were created by the Jesuits to further the goals of their master Baphomet.
Comment by bryan —
January 30, 2008 @ 3:01 am
hmm, well I always figured it was a conspiracy chiefly between Cheney and his top middle eastern agent, Osama Bin Laden. I remember saying to myself some time after it happened, okay either they didn’t do it, in which case they bring Bin Laden in and spare no expense in money and lives doing it because it will be a surefire election winner, or he did it and they let him slip away.
Of course my theory still requires that Arabic men on suicide missions flew planes into skyscrapers.
Comment by The Modesto Kid —
January 30, 2008 @ 8:15 am
Come on, how are the Illuminati a “small Middle Eastern country”? They’re pretty well home-grown. (Unless they’re extraterrestrial and I’m getting them mixed up with the Freemasons.)
Comment by wade —
January 30, 2008 @ 9:36 am
And who is this Baphomet? of course, he is the earthly representative of the shape shifting reptillian lizard men. Did you see any mention of 9/11 investigators testing for traces of lizardy scales? No?? Have you asked yourself why????!!?
Comment by Bruce Baugh —
January 30, 2008 @ 1:19 pm
Alas, antisemitism is very, very common just about anyplace people get serious about questioning visible systems of power, as is a lot of other prejudice. Consider some of the stuff that appeared in Ron Paul’s newsletters. It takes some genuine effort to keep the skepticism about visible structures without descending into bigoted convictions about alternative structures.
Comment by Dave W. —
January 30, 2008 @ 1:28 pm
We went online again in search of someone to blame. . . . Maybe that’s why we couldn’t find any alternate scapegoat.
Isaac Newton wrote some equations that described how he believed that gravity worked. However, his equations did not explain why gravity worked that way, who or what was responsible for making gravity work the way he said it did. I am not sure whether this is known to this day. Does this make Newton’s equations suspect?
Comment by bbartlog —
January 30, 2008 @ 1:49 pm
The principal bigotry in the newsletters appeared to me to be anti-black and homophobic. Aside from some negative comments on AIPAC I don’t recall anything that could be construed as antisemitism.
Comment by John Markley —
January 30, 2008 @ 2:00 pm
Just be glad our conspiracies weren’t outsourced to India. Imagine how much it would suck to have the American government and global finance secretly controlled by Thuggees.
Comment by Timothy —
January 30, 2008 @ 2:03 pm
Yes, Dave, that Puritanical bastard was really covering up for the Zionist Falling Conspiracy! THE JEWS ARE THE CAUSE OF ALL THE FALLING IN THE UNIVERSE! BE WARNED! ALSO, THE ILLUMINATI ARE IN ON IT, IT ALL RELATED TO WHAT THEY’RE PUTTING IN THE DRINKING WATER!
Comment by William Burns —
January 30, 2008 @ 2:26 pm
I can’t believe the way everyone is covering up for the Servants of Cthulhu.
Comment by Jennifer —
January 30, 2008 @ 2:59 pm
I can’t believe the way everyone is covering up for the Servants of Cthulhu.
You would believe it, if you saw the size of the media bribes he hands out. Holy shit I am so rich now.
Comment by Thoreau —
January 30, 2008 @ 3:11 pm
Jennifer, has anybody told you what Cthulu has planned for your immortal soul?
Comment by Will —
January 30, 2008 @ 3:19 pm
How do we know that the Bush Administration didn’t commit this act, very be simply, it was actually pulled off. If Bush & Co were behind this the Twin Towers would still be up & the whole operation would seriously behind schedule & tens of billions of dollars over budget.
Comment by Thoreau —
January 30, 2008 @ 3:22 pm
Will wins the thread.
I can just see the meeting in the smoke-filled room: “We’ve turned the corner. We toppled a scale model made of balsa wood, as you can see on this video. But we’ll need another $1 billion for Halliburton to move personnel to NYC and get them set up.”
Comment by Jennifer —
January 30, 2008 @ 4:47 pm
Jennifer, has anybody told you what Cthulu has planned for your immortal soul?
No worse than what Jesus has planned for my soul ever since he discovered I don’t believe in him.
Comment by joe —
January 30, 2008 @ 6:26 pm
Of all the conspiracy theories, the one about the Illuminati being alien lizard-men is my favorite.
What I like best about those people is that they are divided into anti-semitic and non-antisemitic factions. Can you imagine the conventions?
“Margaret Thatcher isn’t a Jew. James Baker isn’t a Jew.”
“I didn’t say they were ALL Jews!”
“You’re making us look like a bunch of anti-semitic lunatics.”
“You can’t handle the truth!”
“Jew-hater!”
“Lizard Dupe!”
“Hey! Cut it out, you two! This is a serious academic conference!”
Comment by Gary Farber —
January 30, 2008 @ 8:10 pm
“Are there no more American conspiracies?”
I have to point out that we American Jews are Americans, and therefore need to be given proper credit for our undermining from within.
I blame your lack of willingness to blame the Jews on anti-semitism.
Comment by Thoreau —
January 30, 2008 @ 8:19 pm
Gary-
I apologize. I should learn to respect the diverse ways in which Americans of diverse backgrounds can conspire to do evil.
I look at 24, with their rainbow coalition of villains from every background, and a tear comes to my eye.
Comment by the talking dog —
January 30, 2008 @ 11:09 pm
Some of the conspiracy theories are kind of funny (admittedly, not so much to me, btw, who happened to be across the street from WTC that morning)… but even I relish the Bush family involvement– younger bro Marvin especially, who was not only involved in the company providing security to the WTC, United Airlines AND Dulles Airport, AND was on the board of the WTC’s reinsurer AND was in NYC that day. I’m still waiting to see a photo-shopped picture of Marvin with a plunger and the burning WTC in the background.
Still and all… whatever else we may have thought, with respect to trying to find out anything, at least, we now learn that the 9-11 Commission was indeed a cover-up from the get-go… particularly Condi’s close personal friend Phil Zelikow making sure that neither Condi’s role… NOR HIS OWN… ever saw the light of day.
Nice.
Comment by Donald Johnson —
January 30, 2008 @ 11:39 pm
My problem with the Truthers is probably similar to the chattering canine’s. It would not surprise me if there are some shocking things being covered up about 9/11, but if so it’s going to be darn near impossible to make a case for that given all the nuts with their planted explosives and Bush and/or Israel did it notions.
Not that I have my own pet theory to push–I don’t.
Also, in general there’s a Gresham’s law of conspiracy theories–the bad ones drive out or discredit the good ones. Ordinary people who aren’t like the obsessives who read political blogs often can’t tell the difference between shocking statements about US government actions that are fully documented and noncontroversial from the sorts of things the 9/11 Truthers say.
Comment by wellbasically —
January 30, 2008 @ 11:57 pm
Sam Smith of progressive review had a lot of information suggesting that the building construction was rushed during the Depression, and fireproofing codes were inadequate or ignored. The implication would mean billions in improvements needed on US skyscrapers, which is as good a reason as any to suppress a thorough investigation.
Comment by Thoreau —
January 31, 2008 @ 1:00 am
wellbasically-
Except that the WTC was built in the 1960’s.
For all I know, it may very well be that shoddy construction was part of the problem, and the commission decided to gloss over that because it would also bring out lots of other shoddy construction. But as your comment stands, the part about Depression-era construction is not applicable.
Comment by wade —
January 31, 2008 @ 9:42 am
A conspiracy theory about conspiracy theories: if one were to mount a sizable conspiracy, the sensible thing to do would be to disseminate many conspiracy theories like so much chaff.
Therefore, some obsessive with the requisite skillz, could trace back the origins of the theories, and if they all came from one computer, bingo! we’ve got our man.
Comment by mds —
January 31, 2008 @ 11:43 am
Its annihilation, naturally. However, Jennifer presumably believes that she will be among the fortunate ones who will be eaten first.
What’s remained popular in Wyoming (okay, at least among my brother-in-law’s circle) is that the Cheney administration didn’t plan the attacks, but that their desire for limitless casus belli was behind their apparent blindness to all the advance warnings. Yeah, it still has some hallmarks of conspiracy theory (esp. when John Ashcroft’s sudden switch to charter aircraft comes up), but I feel there’s still a difference. One’s choices are after all pretty much limited to “stupid or evil?”
Comment by Dave W. —
January 31, 2008 @ 6:53 pm
It would not surprise me if there are some shocking things being covered up about 9/11, but if so it’s going to be darn near impossible to make a case for that given all the nuts with their planted explosives and Bush and/or Israel did it notions.
It is really not that hard:
1. Someone with US military connections sent the anthrax and wanted it to look like Al Queda.
2. Dick Cheney slowed down the air response by pretending to be uncertain about what was happening and what the appropriate response could possibly be. There were planes that could have intercepted a lot quicker. But you can’t prove that later, and Dick Cheney knew that on the morning of 9/11.
3. Flight 93 was shot down, eventually, anyway. Dick Cheney also knew that there was some outside limit on the amount of time he could pretend to be uncertain.
4. WTC7 was brought down by explosives. Not that sinister — it was coming down sooner or later. Only the denial is kind of weird.
Those are the shockers. All the other stuff you can tune out.
Comment by Avram —
January 31, 2008 @ 7:32 pm
WTC7 was brought down by explosives.
That right there is not the sort of claim that ought to be made by a person who wants to be taken seriously.
Comment by Dave W. —
January 31, 2008 @ 7:50 pm
That right there is not the sort of claim that ought to be made by a person who wants to be taken seriously.
why? Damaged buildings are demolished all the time. There was plenty of time to get the explosives in there. Nobody was hurt or killed by the demolition. Probably most importantly of all, nobody has denied that it was demolished. They just haven’t acknowledged it.
are you confusing wtc7 with the Twin Towers?
WTC7 funlink:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lylHrpLOpzg
Comment by dhex —
February 1, 2008 @ 2:04 pm
google video used to have a canadian doc called david icke and the jews (or something along those lines).
the best moment is when the filmmaker is meeting with someone from the ADL and they say “we think he’s talking about jews when he talks about 12 foot lizards” and the filmmaker goes “i’ve spent a lot of time around him and i think when he says lizards he means lizards.”
he also accuses alex jones of being either ignorant or on the take in that video; jones accuses him of making the rest of them look bad.
talk about a pr nightmare.